Open Mike

Place of the offtopic, funny or interesting threads, discussions about history, politics, movies and other war games.

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-01-30 13:57, Thursday

of course i could never stop, but one must stop at one point.... very intriguing stuff if not something "to rock historical science". Since i mentioned it must also add other very interesting part, in that "Roman influence or gene" faction/school of historical fiction :) (but as noted, must include at least a part of truth and proof) Namely, founding narrative of Rascian state is also of two brothers in dispute - older being named Vukan i.e. of wolf origin - leading to war and overthrow with two influences but they are finally reconciled by third brother and the younger becomes first king of Rascia later marries in Venice etc... deviation from Roman story with surely religious additions (since it covers late XII c) but clearly recognizable to Latin one

in all my posts I forgot also important "Celtic element" and surely people that left some trace here and maybe influenced some habits, myths, practices and customs to extent, without question. But never lived in that region close to coast so maybe later with expansion some of their elements - like bload sucking or horns - entered mixture...

now i don't want to post everyday, surely older history (esp. ancient) is neverending dispute to all globally, lots of detective work..... to repeat (last time) what would be the point in practice if i made separate thread on history and intriguing stories, so i used this space (grateful to Hex to giving it to me) although it has no connection with name.... see you later and i do play ocasionally. )

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-01-30 21:49, Thursday

number of grammatical/typing errors is criminal and maybe deserves more apology to readers than political satire :lol i assure all they are unintentional (i keep all my posts as book so i see later what i wrote)... went as far as using Sarmato-English being sure word "primesa" is global :lol ... sometimes i type faster than acceptable for language i don't master.

apropos Celts drinking blood, it is just my theory (from our Roman sources that they were blood suckers) that Scordisci - local Celtic tribe living north - are maybe source of vampire fame (in this region), nothing sure

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-01-31 13:33, Friday

Problem I see with Sarmatian part - while I don't doubt such minds as Plinius, Ptolemaios and all involved and give it great percentage of truth that they "found us" - is that there were little signs in our medieval history of "powerful or influential" women. And by Sarmatian story - which might not be true at all, just narrative - women had "role in war and tribe" (simply said)..... but then again, many centuries passed since those days, religion, mixing and fact that most of women in court were foreign have some significance :) In short, Scythians & Sarmatae do have some cultural traits that survived all that. I was very "shocked" to find out words of Scythian ruler to Darius of Persia during war "....graves of our ancestors/fathers..." he said, some phrase used here often much later :lol And not only that, cavalry was important, no bigger cities etc. etc. Historical consensus is that Sarmatians were "Sla(o)venised" before Serb arrival on Balkans, though (if there was arrival at all))

One more time to mention Vukan and our Roman story, it is not 100% certain but his wife was from Latium (Lazio) even more adding to mistery and enigma, very, very cute one... On that, I'm afraid we will never know the full truth about those days as both scientist here and in Italy know that it is "sensitive subject" (due to religious differences) and how many Roman-Italian people and influnce joined Serb initial states then will stay like that, blured/cute story. Later and modern history certainly did not help, but maybe being partly "misterious" is likable part of it

now, let's try to give it a rest...... at least over weekend :) but generally think it is interesting, so i share

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-02 20:48, Sunday

but surely i will not bore people constantly :) ... there is always something to add, big fan of ancient history. I learnt from Italian TV that Italy is first by "cultural influence" in the world, while i found separately that Greeks are people "who in greatest percent in the world consider their culture superior" (if asked yes or no). No idea if any is true and what are methods and statistical data, but any of my posts is not contest :) .... Italian comic books were (even more than in their country) popular here, was one of growing on them - but research is objective, I guarantee. But has own conclusions too

i was "noted" about more Scythian related things - not so interesting to readers - in past 2 days and want to round that "important subject" for now... "skitati" is word used in our language (but not only) for "wandering or roaming around", couldn't find exact tie with that people but there might be one. They also liked gold and controlled exports, parallel with out medieval history and how Serb elite looked by Byzantine sources i.e. "figure and shining in gold", they had no navy and our state (although had coast) never had mentionable navy until emperor bought some galleys from Venice in XIV century etc. i'm also more of opinion that Scyths, not Sarmatae, might really be our "lost tribe and ancestors" (but they are related). Enough for now, will post anything only if really interesting... if "we" are not from Asia but in any way more closer to Romans and it's ever definitely proved, it would be great discovery :yes (liked all analogies and possible mutual origins in big percent, can't say no) No reason not to think about all that, there are ancient sources from both Greek and Roman world including tribe name root.

last time on mining in middle ages - actually there was no need for ancient Rome maps when there is great fra Mauro map (our man, like Plinius etc)) of late medieval world one can look at great detail here, special thanks to Clemens/Randowe. Must admit even I - knowing a lot about period and having other sources and first interest in ancient history - forgot/knew little about that source until he posted link, lots of interesting things in time of his life there, but not all:


https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servle ... Cseries_no

i'm really over now :)

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Re: Open Mike

Post by randowe » 2020-02-02 21:34, Sunday

Interesting map. Great that we can investigate a map from the year 1450 so easy today sitting at home :yes

Fosseda oro et argento next to Servia. Servia = Serbia and Argento = silver, but what does fosseda mean? Or are there other letters?

When researching the black sea coast and looking for some latin names i found a pdf file with descrptios and translations of the names on the map.
Recently, when i did the research for my next OG campaign i came across a impressive castle, the Akkerman Fortress at nowaday Bilhorod-Dnistrowskyj near Odessa.
Looking at your map i can find a name inocastro. In the pdf i can find a mocastro and maurocastro mentioned which seems to refer to Akkerman/Bilhorod-Dnistrowskyj.

The pdf mentions "Mines of gold and silver" in "Serbia". "Mines in Serbian territory; probably the deposits of Bor and Majdanpek."

Here is the pdf: http://www.myoldmaps.com/late-medieval- ... ptions.pdf

Akkerman Fortress:

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-02 23:10, Sunday

ah, Clemens don't do it to me in this hour :lol
but what does fosseda mean?
i read it like "deposits of gold and silver" maybe fosse da...
i can find a mocastro and maurocastro mentioned which seems to refer to Akkerman/Bilhorod-Dnistrowskyj.
Bilhorod is interesting part, but that is just Slavic word, not related to our capital today... which actally wasn't important to our medieval history at all and mostly in Hungarian posesion... Mauro is Italian for "black" or similar but nothing to do with racial characteristic, for example Vlach-Romanic people were called Mauroulachi and similar... much much later (in different era) Serbs in hills of Dalamtia were called like that too (often wrongly). Nothing else interesting to our medieval history, i'd guess :)
The pdf mentions "Mines of gold and silver" in "Serbia". "Mines in Serbian territory; probably the deposits of Bor and Majdanpek."
biggest mine in medieval time (and one fra Mauro reffers to) was actually Novo Brdo as he calls ir "Nouvo Monte", Kosovo region then. Biggest Saxon colony and town that grew under Serb rule and in 1455 fell finally, that's why map is interesting as it still had fame in Italian lands, even though mostly troubled by advancing Ottoman-Turkish army... but yes there were other deposits around, including Bor & Majdanpek area since our Roman times... French sources of the time also mention Nouvo Bardo )) (c. 1450) and how important it was for income of rulers, but it played role since start of XIII c.

thanks for asking and adding all :yes more some other day if interesting, must say i don't need other sources exclusively, not so detailed look at pdf. and concentrated a lot on other things recently, find me in 500 BC around Caspian sea :lol

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-03 14:01, Monday

important (to extent) is question of "looks" and in modern world "sensitive"... I already told enough, but for even more clearness more about "colors" :lol ...Ancient sources had no problems with it and often openly talked about "looks" of northern people... but not that - one more time - in Italian lands (and Greek and ours under their influence) it was often question of dressing code (even life habits) as many people had light colors in their outfit, while other with darker/black color domination. Guess generally that black was often related to Serbs, even in Mongol, Turkish and Byzantine sources relating to early XV century extending even to armoured knights (mainly battle of Ankara etc).... some people may looked differently and lots of mixes, but i'm explaining that aspect generally. like "Black George" for Turks, meaning of that dressing/life style origin + fearsome. It is easy subject :)

truly dislike politics in history - that's why sometimes bash wikipedia too - but it often has some great lines and references.

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-04 14:19, Tuesday

on that subject i.e. Maurovlachs - which is subject of interpretations as many others ) - just to add what our sources from middle ages "say" (simplified and in short)... for looking at subject it is important to note that sources (like Dušan Codex, best of all) mostly considered Vlachs, hence Mauro-ones too in parallel, not as "inital Serbs" i.e. separate entity in some (unclear) ethnic sense of the time. But it is unlear generally who Royal Scyths (Serbs) mixed with Romans & Greeks (via mother line) considered as Serbs of the time at all, to say it humoristically :lol Back to Maurovlachs or Morlaks i think most readers know that they even inspired H. G. Wells alien race in novels :)

question of tribe generation (later nation) is interesting at least and how it compromised various element in its base, especially since tribe itself didn't have some "specific nor superior" culture compared to others, but it grew both in size and manpower compared to others who stayed smaller... so all that goes in that field. Maybe indeed more persuasive (or aggressive where royal Scyth story would fit), more mixed, better economy or else, unknown.

I want to keep historical post added (maybe not at similar frequence) but at the same time want to change subject - problem is that I cannot and get back to subjects i know about more :) see you later, really appreciate Clemens' "interest" )

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-04 19:08, Tuesday

...or maybe not, apropos HG Wells, after checking his english language wikipedia page (maybe Scots or else))... Is there anything certain in this world? :lol but, if he did use name as inspiration how about theory that Venetian galleys were able to shoot much higher than previously thought, so we (or them) acidentally brought down some alien patrol spaceship in early XIV century, that's why Dante was so upset in fact? :lol

English/Brits - like them or not politically at the age - played important role in XIX c, like giving new life to Plinius map globally and else interesting in historical research.... to my Slavic readers, whole research and interest in ancient subject is based on sources and some ties, nothing against Slavic languages and tribes :yes of course it's Slavic language... after Bulgars and (cute Slavic settlers) taught us to use it :) Ancient history is misterious, even leading experts on Rome (for example) have doubts about buildings, let alone rest of story...

little humor, from now on i'll try to be scientifically interesting if make any post, but there is decent amount of that already

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-05 15:34, Wednesday

so... after few days i actually looked at outside source and pdf Clemens linked to (not realted to site I linked to))

at first i thought it's something political - without looking at it :) - but after going through pages, must just say that mister's (or of more persons, unimportant) translations and geographical locations are just wrong in several instances. Sometimes due to fra Mauro's beautiful handwriting :) , sometimes due to not perfect Italian translation, sometimes due to problems to locate geographical places, to distinguish between Mauro's cartographical legend and between province, river, city and similar... guess no malicious nor ignorant intent, there are wrong translations even to other countries. I did not find it important to contact mister via mail, but showed it to someone who might once eventually, but doubt... It is not source of "super science" just some site on the net :yes ...in concrete, trouble for mister was (i guess) inability to locate Nuovo Monte/Bardo today - because it doesn't exist anymore. just archeological site and it is not (as he translated) Novi Pazar. I explained that anyway, that's not something very dubious in any histroiography :yes

that to be clear, if there is someone with eventual troubles from history of the era - or even old Rome - I can help mostly with Serbia, in limited way other countries (maybe Italy). Do not speak Italian though! but can do some things with it )

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-06 19:10, Thursday

still having fun with fra Mauro map, but will not enter a series of posts about it, on the contrary last one ; Great piece of work - looking also in colored versions - given time of making, and great man :) lots of material for satire i sometimes write and interesting lines there for use...

however what surprises me is how inaccurate it is, on micro level... on macro level, as it was primarily source for sea navigation, navigators etc, it is great but I can imagine it would have caused lots of trouble for some Venetian traders traveling in caravan by land :) for example Belgrado is placed so much north-east of Venice, while in reality it is more south-east of it. So Italian traders using it by land go straight north and travel east, finish somewhere who-knows-where northeast and ask "did we reach Belgrado already?" :lol (for example) Surprised that he didn't notice great turning of river Danube south after Austrian lands in those days and things like that, speaking of accuracy... also i'd like to note that cities are not (exclusively) drawn by size or importance - so bigger picture doesn't mean bigger or more important city by automatism - just fra Mauro sometimes didn't waste much space nor ink on more known world. Because if bigger would mean more important, Genoa (or Rome) would look like villages at best, not true even though Mauro was Venetian :) just small clarification.

nonetheless, interesting one Mauro, and hopefully enjoyable to those not very familiar with it.

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-08 20:59, Saturday

after looking around, actually my Venetian galley theory, Serb "Men in black", aliens and all wouldn't be very original as I found articles and interview to our press where Erich von Däniken said he saw aliens on some of the frescoes in our monasteries :lol ...however, that is all a bit too fantastic i'm not against challenging narratives, but in possible not fantastic way. Scyths maybe, aliens hardly :)

anyway, for change one photo, found right boxes and assorted range of titles, Italian comic books. I have hundreds of them although mostly title from upper right corner, loved humoristic serie popular here. The rest i mostly sold long time ago (i regret now) kept just few tens...

just for people to feel what "Italian cultural influence" looks like :) ...now what to talk about next.... no idea but maybe something will comeup ;

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-10 13:41, Monday

of course those are not only "cultural influences" from Italian lands, there are many and they are long since our Servius Tullius, as explained before :) And Venice - without them and Dandoli there would be (maybe) no great dinasty and empire to remember :) ... But there are no many memebers from those lands around so more about German lands and (long historical) ties and friendship a bit. They exist ever since great cooperation when we lived in Saxony, then Heinrich the Lion wrote some great lines about that friendship, then emperor Barabrossa made official visit... relations were crowned in mid XIII century when our king addressed Saxon colonists with great, legendary words written in chronicles: "In this sinful world there's two kinds of people, my friends: those with big axes and those who dig. You dig." Words still remembered and interpretated till this day...

but now - trying to help professor-doctor Däniken research a bit - the way I see it is as possible is... after downing of alien spaceship (mechanical error is a chance) Serbs and Venetians are involved in that story. They know what happened, but keep it secret to the world (Dante somehow knew about episode). Some aliens escape to hills, but ship and all kind of material and devices end up in Serb & Venetian hands. Serbs take some armor and wepons - later leading to famous "black armor" in sources, obviously of impenetrable alien origin and make empire, not lasting long though - while Venetians take some astro devices and maps - later leading to empire, famous cartography and even renaissance in broader Italian lands... aliens survive in hills, despite all "men in black" expeditions and hunt, and much later accept either Serb, Croat or Italian ethnic identity.

:lol until later...

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-12 15:29, Wednesday

medieval history is much more complex than some people think and often trying to squeeze some periods, countries and relations in one paragraph is uneasy task and leads to simplified solutions and conclusions... in that sense, relation with Venice is often simplified, wrongly looked at through lense of religion, worth mentioning and researching more. Venetian actions were not supported by Rome, Vatican and papacy in some instances (like 4th crusade), but supported by our rulers (at least indirectly) while some actions/decisions of Rome and Vatican were not supported by Venice, like their cooperation with our emperor (again indirectly, he was Venetian citizen after all and disliked Genova)) Dušan, whome Papal office warned not to expand in some cases...etc. Lots of finesess there and material to understand better. of course, i can do big books about that, go into tiny details, but not the place nor some interest... but in any time anyone is free and welcome to talk about it, give some sources or opinion on anything I wrote. It is helpful like Clemens' example which found some (relatively important for archeology) unintentional errors in work by mister from Texas :yes

doing some hobby style things and research, found this (funny to look at) map by two US and one Spanish academics few years ago, showing "cultural fractinalization i.e. diversity" through world, not to be mixed with ethno-linguistic or racial diversity... Unimportant if absolutely true or not, different research will probably have different results - but why is funny as it places my country in top of countries by that category.... that's why my country with diverse cultural influences is often considered as country with no culture at all :lol this paragraph is just in lighter tone and not so important, just somehow unexpected (or not so) result by 3 professors and share it for fun and is of interest only for Scythology, Romanology & Ufology :)

unitil better ideas, ave. (...i post all this just to be present sporadically, change of subject or common-continental law differences welcome...))

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-14 12:49, Friday

for people liking more modern analogies there is interesting conclusion - times and many things change but one thing is constant and that is that Italian lands/Italy was and is our most important foreign trading partner since Plinius, empire, middle ages until today. Rome eternal :lol (and one of the rare western countries we had sufficit with in times)

but as i explained, it is not all about money, objectively they helped in many instances, defended our monuments etc. because Servius Tullius did a lot for them and they know it :) ... i did all this "block" just as it is interesting and I think not so known to many people, often surprised by some details from medieval (or modern) history, but they shouldn't be, hence it is helpful and prevents mistakes in research. other relations are mostly known, but i'll keep my posts historical and fun.... if there are any in future )

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-15 12:49, Saturday

actually why not adding more on that subject... so, top five would look like this:

"The top export destinations of Serbia are Germany (deficit), Italy (surplus), Bosnia and Herzegovina (surplus), Russia (deficit) and Romania (surplus)."

numbers are realtively small compared to many in places you sit in, so i changed them with surprlus (sufficit) and deficit in trade instead. Top 5 states buying stuff from us i.e. the most "friendly" markets. Philosophical question of the moment is can one consider them most important/friendly relations overall... there is something for anybody's taste there :lol and certainly indicative list.

But importance of one country to another is not two-way relation as trade numbers/percents aren't either, nor people are aware of trade relations when they think about world. never was strictly mercantile person myself either, but decided to post this as it is interesting and include countries of importance or "emotional affection" in heads, so not far from truth. (mama Italy))

now as subject is diverse as is, feel free to say anything interesting from your PoV, without my country included in that post..... if not, doesn't matter as i'm mostly done :p

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-15 18:44, Saturday

important question in many heads is probably "what are they buying from you?" i'll help:

1. Germany - cheap labor & scientific/philosophical books mostly

2. Italy - of course, glam silver and gold

3. Bosnia - our flags (partly) & petroleum to burn our flags (other part)

4. Russia - mostly rocks labeled as "apples" in papers & military equipment

5. Romania - woolen hats and vests & barbed wire (for eventual future use)



:lol ...just for fun, don't mind un-pc humor if any, but i'm mostly not doing much of satirical stuff anyway ...

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Re: Open Mike

Post by Ale » 2020-02-17 13:42, Monday

spent few days diving deep in those sites and relations (locally & globally) so i know more about world now and i know what you did last summer :) recommend that to all not familiar.

regarding 5th place of export pals, Romania is deservedly on that spot but must add that numbers are similar and close for Montenegro, Bulgaria and Hungary and will probably fluctuate on that spot (Romania my fav))... when it comes to so called "Anglo-Saxon world" - one cannot go without mentioning it - it is interesting that we have surplus in trade with both UK & US (very small in US case) but anual trade numbers are as small as monthly budget of bigger football club, although bigger trade numbers than countries like Greece or Ukraine for example )

other bigger or more famous countries close to top 10 are France, Austria, Turkey and Poland... as conclusion - mama Italy, for example, is 10x bigger in population but their exports are roughly 30x bigger than ours. Lots to work on there to level it on 10x bigger export numbers :) ...not sure with trends and population age but lets imagine as possible.... thoughts welcome :p

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Scale Consistency & Scalability

Post by HexCode » 2020-02-20 19:27, Thursday

Quite exceptionally, I find myself returning to grab the mike... :evil

Half a century ago, two seminal hex-based, turn-based wargames, Blitzkrieg and Panzerblitz, launched two partially overlapping wargaming traditions. Blitzkrieg ushered in the era of Strategy Wargaming. Panzerblitz did the same for Historical Wargaming.

Two of the topmost concerns in Historical Wargaming have been how to establish geographical and magnitude consistency as well as pursue scalability across the board. The object has always been to render multiple battle situations playable under the same rules and unit specifications.

The goal of geographical consistency is to establish definitive, unchanging dimensions underlying a typical map hex. In this context, scalability poses the challenge of designing maps sporting hexes of varying dimensions while somehow tinkering with rules and unit specifications so as to keep "things" objective...

The goal of magnitude consistency is to establish definitive, unchanging interpretations of the meaning of a typical unit strength point. In this context, scalability poses the challenge of specifying units of varying sizes while somehow designing appropriate maps so as to keep "things" objective...

Elsewhere in these forums, a poster has recently brought up such matters. In my opinion, it may be more appropriate to pursue some envisaged discussion regarding these matters "in here" as opposed to a forum dedicated to some particular wargame. :2cents

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